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Post by Sheep2 on Feb 19, 2020 20:46:55 GMT
Felice
I've read about the small, but not negligible number of babies who are born each year with ambiguous or malformed genitalia. Or with chromosomes which don't always correspond to 23XY pairs.
The treatment they get and the way gender is assigned is often appalling.
I heard that it is about 1.7% of people who differ in some (usually minor) way. And somewhere beetwwen 1 in 1,000 aand 1 in 10,000 who have a more major differences. I am reluctant to label them all as disorders, although as with degrees of autism it is clearly a disorder at the more problematic end.
When you read it you can sort of see why some people regard large parts of gender as 'assigned'. I think it's generally those with such issues who write about cisgender.
It's tricky though because the majority have a strong sense of gender and cis/trans gender issues often seem a bit strange and uncomfortable.
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Post by Felice Landry on Feb 19, 2020 20:47:14 GMT
Beautiful song, you do sound a bit like a Government Spox* though. *Ugh |
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Post by Tuffers on Feb 19, 2020 20:56:15 GMT
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Post by RollingEscargot on Feb 19, 2020 20:56:27 GMT
Felice I've read about the small, but not negligible number of babies who are born each year with ambiguous or malformed genitalia. Or with chromosomes which don't always correspond to 23XY pairs. The treatment they get and the way gender is assigned is often appalling. I heard that it is about 1.7% of people who differ in some (usually minor) way. And somewhere beetwwen 1 in 1,000 aand 1 in 10,000 who have a more major differences. I am reluctant to label them all as disorders, although as with degrees of autism it is clearly a disorder at the more problematic end. When you read it you can sort of see why some people regard large parts of gender as 'assigned'. I think it's generally those with such issues who write about cisgender. It's tricky though because the majority have a strong sense of gender and cis/trans gender issues often seem a bit strange and uncomfortable. I know that pedantry is frowned upon on this forum, but are you not talking about sex rather than gender? A lot of the confusion in these debates is generated by conflating the two. |
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Post by Felice Landry on Feb 19, 2020 20:58:03 GMT
Pedantry is frowned upon? Fuck, I'm in the wrong place.
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Post by Sheep2 on Feb 19, 2020 21:23:56 GMT
Felice I've read about the small, but not negligible number of babies who are born each year with ambiguous or malformed genitalia. Or with chromosomes which don't always correspond to 23XY pairs. The treatment they get and the way gender is assigned is often appalling. I heard that it is about 1.7% of people who differ in some (usually minor) way. And somewhere beetwwen 1 in 1,000 aand 1 in 10,000 who have a more major differences. I am reluctant to label them all as disorders, although as with degrees of autism it is clearly a disorder at the more problematic end. When you read it you can sort of see why some people regard large parts of gender as 'assigned'. I think it's generally those with such issues who write about cisgender. It's tricky though because the majority have a strong sense of gender and cis/trans gender issues often seem a bit strange and uncomfortable. I know that pedantry is frowned upon on this forum, but are you not talking about sex rather than gender? A lot of the confusion in these debates is generated by conflating the two. The current distinction between the terms sex difference versus gender difference has been criticized as misleading and counterproductive. These terms suggest that the behavior of an individual can be partitioned into separate biological and cultural factors. (However, behavioral differences between individuals can be statistically partitioned, as studied by behavioral genetics.) Instead, all behaviors are phenotypes—a complex interweaving of both nature and nurture.[41] So no. |
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Post by Shenguin on Feb 19, 2020 21:24:48 GMT
Pedantry is that upon which it is frowned? Fuck, I'm in the wrong place. ftfy |
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Post by Sheep2 on Feb 19, 2020 21:25:52 GMT
Rather it is you making the mistake by trying to separate two intrinsically linked subjects. One of which, gender, is not clearly definable except in terms of the other.
The R4 programme I listened to was specifically about gender identity issues in people with non-standard sexual characteristics. I may not have made this sufficiently clear.
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Post by Sheep2 on Feb 19, 2020 21:26:29 GMT
TL:DR
You are wrong.
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Post by Sheep2 on Feb 19, 2020 21:26:56 GMT
Yes, you.
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Post by RollingEscargot on Feb 19, 2020 21:28:31 GMT
I guess that's me told.
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Post by Sheep2 on Feb 19, 2020 21:32:01 GMT
It's a really complex subject. And surprisingly difficult to masturbate to. I can see why you thought I may have been confused. Also the wiki bit I quoted is describing part of the controversy. Technically it is possible I may not yet have fully formed my final views on the issues. |
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Post by Destry on Feb 19, 2020 21:38:46 GMT
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Post by Sheep2 on Feb 19, 2020 21:43:05 GMT
It was only a matter of time before someone popped up with an offensive joke about wanking. I thought it might as well be me.
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Post by Felice Landry on Feb 19, 2020 21:44:33 GMT
Felice I've read about the small, but not negligible number of babies who are born each year with ambiguous or malformed genitalia. Or with chromosomes which don't always correspond to 23XY pairs. The treatment they get and the way gender is assigned is often appalling. I heard that it is about 1.7% of people who differ in some (usually minor) way. And somewhere beetwwen 1 in 1,000 aand 1 in 10,000 who have a more major differences. I am reluctant to label them all as disorders, although as with degrees of autism it is clearly a disorder at the more problematic end. When you read it you can sort of see why some people regard large parts of gender as 'assigned'. I think it's generally those with such issues who write about cisgender. It's tricky though because the majority have a strong sense of gender and cis/trans gender issues often seem a bit strange and uncomfortable. Thank you, the first thing the preferred mammal, who did Biology, said when I asked her as she walked in the door*, was the same thing as your first sentence. She quibbles with your numbers, though that is unimportant, it is always nice to learn something new. *we have fun. |
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Post by RollingEscargot on Feb 19, 2020 21:45:39 GMT
It's a really complex subject. And surprisingly difficult to masturbate to. I can see why you thought I may have been confused. Also the wiki bit I quoted is describing part of the controversy. Technically it is possible I may not yet have fully formed my final views on the issues. No, you were clear. I did not think you were confused. But generally speaking sex is the term when you are talking about biology; gender when you are talking about social categories. To make the distinction is not to reify either, or to imply that they are not related. So it's sex that's assigned at birth. That's all I was getting at. Like I said, pedantry. I'm a sex pedant. |
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Post by Sheep2 on Feb 19, 2020 21:49:19 GMT
You've misspelt pest.
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Post by Tuffers on Feb 19, 2020 22:05:26 GMT
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Post by Tuffers on Feb 19, 2020 22:06:33 GMT
cis THIS
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Post by Shenguin on Feb 19, 2020 23:12:32 GMT
Sheeps's a girl now? I had no idea. Good for them, being so brave.
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Post by Destry on Feb 19, 2020 23:29:20 GMT
Evening.
And you can tell Priti Vacant that I have no intention of coming out of retirement to pick soft fruit in Lincolnshire for minimum wage.
Chumbles, Felice, are you with me?
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Post by Chumbles on Feb 19, 2020 23:40:38 GMT
Evening. And you can tell Priti Vacant that I have no intention of coming out of retirement to pick soft fruit in Lincolnshire for minimum wage. Chumbles, Felice, are you with me? You are so right ... not the least because my long fight to stay out of hospital would be over in half a day. I find their "Let's throw this policy against the wall and see if it sticks" attitude terrifying. Before us there are plenty in Lincolnshire who should reap the harvest... Their 'brighter future' starts now... |
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Post by Felice Landry on Feb 19, 2020 23:44:40 GMT
Evening. And you can tell Priti Vacant that I have no intention of coming out of retirement to pick soft fruit in Lincolnshire for minimum wage. Chumbles, Felice, are you with me? Damn, I agree with both you and Chumbles, what's the world come to? |
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Post by Destry on Feb 19, 2020 23:45:46 GMT
Evening. And you can tell Priti Vacant that I have no intention of coming out of retirement to pick soft fruit in Lincolnshire for minimum wage. Chumbles, Felice, are you with me? Their 'brighter future' starts now... Alas, this is not the Brexit they voted for. |
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Post by tenthenemy on Feb 19, 2020 23:46:53 GMT
Evening. And you can tell Priti Vacant that I have no intention of coming out of retirement to pick soft fruit in Lincolnshire for minimum wage. Chumbles, Felice, are you with me? Damn, I agree with both you and Chumbles, what's the world come to? And you say that the government never does anything for you. |
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