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Post by EasilyLead on Dec 20, 2017 22:10:16 GMT
I blame Battleships. Games at Christmas time always cause family strife.
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Post by tenthenemy on Dec 20, 2017 22:14:49 GMT
Seren has deleted her account. I know, I know. I'm devastated. I don't know what to say. I'm not a native English speaker, so my take on language is sometimes a bit different. It's not something one can easily get across in a forum post, and sometimes it upsets people. |
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Post by sockpuppetpseudonym on Dec 20, 2017 22:15:44 GMT
I feel bad about this. I also defend my, and peoples, right to their heritage. I think the danger of the heritage arguement is that it mirrors that used recently in many areas of the Southern US to defend their love of the Confederate flag, statues of slaveholders and quaint ethno-slurs. The idea that words and images can be wholly separated from negative cultural baggage associated with them solely on the basis of heritage or regional commonality is problematic. |
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Post by Felice Landry on Dec 20, 2017 22:16:04 GMT
Seren has deleted her account. I know, I know. I'm devastated. I don't know what to say. I'm not a native English speaker |
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Post by whatalark on Dec 20, 2017 22:21:06 GMT
I'll no doubt be told to fuck off and all will be in disagreement but Wench in my part of the woods has always been used as a wind up in a good humoured way. In the style of Carry On films.
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Post by crankcaller on Dec 20, 2017 22:22:52 GMT
Oh ffs. It was going so well.
BigG74 what are "Your people" out of interest?
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Post by Felice Landry on Dec 20, 2017 22:23:43 GMT
I'll no doubt be told to fuck off and all will be in disagreement but Wench in my part of the woods has always been used as a wind up in a good humoured way. In the style of Carry On films. Not the greatest example |
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Post by scubar on Dec 20, 2017 22:23:43 GMT
I’m not actually sure what’s happened here
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2017 22:24:41 GMT
You people.
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Post by tenthenemy on Dec 20, 2017 22:24:47 GMT
Apparently I came over all Yankee recently. Nah, German. |
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Post by Deleted on Dec 20, 2017 22:25:30 GMT
I'll no doubt be told to fuck off and all will be in disagreement but Wench in my part of the woods has always been used as a wind up in a good humoured way. In the style of Carry On films. Fuck off I disagree with you |
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Post by Felice Landry on Dec 20, 2017 22:28:30 GMT
Apparently I came over all Yankee recently. Nah, German. Something German something something Humour something |
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Post by whatalark on Dec 20, 2017 22:29:27 GMT
I'll no doubt be told to fuck off and all will be in disagreement but Wench in my part of the woods has always been used as a wind up in a good humoured way. In the style of Carry On films. Fuck off I disagree with you So do I really. I just like to be an awkward sod |
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Post by BigG74 on Dec 20, 2017 22:30:46 GMT
I feel bad about this. I also defend my, and peoples, right to their heritage. I think the danger of the heritage arguement is that it mirrors that used recently in many areas of the Southern US to defend their love of the Confederate flag, statues of slaveholders and quaint ethno-slurs. The idea that words and images can be wholly separated from negative cultural baggage associated with them solely on the basis of heritage or regional commonality is problematic. You are right, but why should my dialect be saddled with "negative cultural baggage" solely on the basis of other regional cultural prejudice. As far as I am aware no one round here is oppressing anyone, in fact it's probably one of the most diverse areas of the country. |
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Post by BigG74 on Dec 20, 2017 22:37:20 GMT
Oh ffs. It was going so well. BigG74 what are "Your people" out of interest? Well I seem to have got myself into all sorts of trouble here. I just mean the group of people I was born into, regionally based dialect speakers. Now I'm in a hole and I'd quite like to stop digging. |
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Post by tenthenemy on Dec 20, 2017 22:39:50 GMT
I think the danger of the heritage arguement is that it mirrors that used recently in many areas of the Southern US to defend their love of the Confederate flag, statues of slaveholders and quaint ethno-slurs. The idea that words and images can be wholly separated from negative cultural baggage associated with them solely on the basis of heritage or regional commonality is problematic. But that's beside the point. The point is that for a dialect speaker a particular word doesn't have the negative cultural baggage it might have developed in the standard language. The Southern US terms connected to race and slavery might have been commonplace, but they were always derogatory. |
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Post by sockpuppetpseudonym on Dec 20, 2017 22:40:00 GMT
I'll no doubt be told to fuck off and all will be in disagreement but Wench in my part of the woods has always been used as a wind up in a good humoured way. In the style of Carry On films. Again, problematic. In the area and era I grew up in, your local Indian owned newsagent or corner shop was called 'the P**i-Shop'. The Indian bus-driver was a 'bud-bud-ding-ding'. Black people weren't routinely called the N word, or the otger N word but N*g-n*g was bandied about with abandon as was S*mbo and others like it. Most of this was entirely without malice and 'all in good fun, just like on the telly'. Words were accepted as the norm that I now feel uncomfortable writing even in a censored form. Words have power to enshrine reductive attitudes and beliefs even when used simply out of habit or as part of local dialect and without ill will. Over time and by highlighting where we find those words problematic or unacceptable, they fall out of use and society inches towards greater equality. It's not censorship or 'PC gone mad'. It's accepting and understanding that when someone disagrees with the use of derogatory term, whether used in jest or good faith, it's not out if ignorance but a desire not to be labelled and reduced. |
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Post by sockpuppetpseudonym on Dec 20, 2017 22:45:16 GMT
Anyway, can't stop.
It's double maths next period.
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Post by Felice Landry on Dec 20, 2017 22:48:10 GMT
I think the danger of the heritage arguement is that it mirrors that used recently in many areas of the Southern US to defend their love of the Confederate flag, statues of slaveholders and quaint ethno-slurs. The idea that words and images can be wholly separated from negative cultural baggage associated with them solely on the basis of heritage or regional commonality is problematic. The point is that for a dialect speaker a particular word doesn't have the negative cultural baggage it might have developed in the standard language. It might not have the "cultural baggage" but unless they're living in a bubble they know what the words represent now, or am I misunderstanding you? |
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Post by crankcaller on Dec 20, 2017 22:49:46 GMT
I get that. I'm not standing here with a pitchfork trying to light a torch. I was just curious to where used the word in question.
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Post by scubar on Dec 20, 2017 22:51:50 GMT
I get that. I'm not standing here with a pitchfork trying to light a torch. I was just curious to where used the word in question. you’re going to struggle to light a torch with a pitchfork. Matches is what you need. |
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Post by Felice Landry on Dec 20, 2017 22:53:42 GMT
I get that. I'm not standing here with a pitchfork trying to light a torch. I was just curious to where used the word in question. you’re going to struggle to light a torch with a pitchfork. Matches is what you need. It could be a burning pitchfork, like the ones villagers use to storm the castle, or am I confused? |
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Post by sockpuppetpseudonym on Dec 20, 2017 22:56:16 GMT
you’re going to struggle to light a torch with a pitchfork. Matches is what you need. It could be a burning pitchfork, like the ones villagers use to storm the castle, or am I confused? The villagers formed a workers collective. A sub-commitee nominated and duly appointed one villager to light and distribute torches thereby freeing up the pitchfork wielders hands. |
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Post by tenthenemy on Dec 20, 2017 23:00:39 GMT
The point is that for a dialect speaker a particular word doesn't have the negative cultural baggage it might have developed in the standard language. It might not have the "cultural baggage" but unless they're living in a bubble they know what the words represent now, or am I misunderstanding you? They know what that word means now in a different language. Which is why BigG would not use "wench" when he speaks standard English, as he stated. But in his language there is no other word for "woman". The fact that the more widely spoken language took that word and contorted it into a derogatory term is not the dialect's fault. |
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Post by BigG74 on Dec 20, 2017 23:00:44 GMT
I'll no doubt be told to fuck off and all will be in disagreement but Wench in my part of the woods has always been used as a wind up in a good humoured way. In the style of Carry On films. Again, problematic. In the area and era I grew up in, your local Indian owned newsagent or corner shop was called 'the P**i-Shop'. Hmmm! Where I grew up the Asian fella that owned the newspaper shop was called the newsagent or Mr. Khan. It was the 70's and, despite popular opinion, we still had respect. |
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